What’s wrong with the Palace?!
I have often told friends and family, if I didn’t live in Sioux Falls, I would not live in SD. While it is nice to visit the boondocks now and then, I prefer the train whistles, airplanes, and the faint smell of JM’s in the air.
No doubt about it. Sioux Falls is the largest city in the state. Our metro area population is almost 33% of the state’s population. Sioux Falls is the single largest contributor to video lottery and sales tax revenue in the state. When we get on our soap box we have a right to be there.
Sometimes.
This whole notion that ‘ALL’ state tournaments belong in SF because we are building an events center is a crock. Rapid City, Aberdeen, Mitchell, Huron, Watertown and even Brookings all have facilities that can host these events, and they should. I can’t even tell you the number of wrestling tournaments I participated at the Corn Palace in the day.
Sometimes SF gets high on the hog, but when it comes to state pride and shared interests, it is better that these tournaments are shared between communities. Not just for economic reasons, but because, god dammit, it is the right thing to do.
WHY THE UPROAR?
Well there is two big reasons this has surfaced.
1) We are building an EC in SF (even though we really don’t need it) and my assumption is that SMG and CVB are scrambling like Hell to find a purpose for the joint, and I am sure our manure spreading mayor has been sitting on their shoulders the whole time.
2) The Sports Authority, and Sanford Health in particular are pushing this move. They feel it is in the best interest of our community. I would agree, economically they are right. The impact would be major. But pissing off our small town neighbors to garner a couple days a year of major tournaments is not really worth it. Our mayor always talks about being ‘neighborly’ Well, Hello, Sailor! Sharing the tournaments works, has for years. Let’s keep it that way. As an Aberdeen resident said to me recently, “It’s just as easy for us to do our ‘big city’ shopping in Fargo as it is in Sioux Falls. Many of us have had it with Sioux Falls’ attitude about being superior, maybe we will take our business there.”
Here! Here!
I love Sioux Falls (to quote Mayor Munson) but sometimes I think we need to get off our high horse and learn to work with the rest of the state. Who the f’ck are we anyhow telling the rest of the state what to do, we don’t even know how to run a simple council meeting, let alone a state tournament.
Right on all counts! And to those who point to the numbers at the Summit last week, keep in mind that the chances of both SDSU teams being in the championship game ever again are very slim.
Maybe SF should apply for their own statehood?
It’s an issue of justifying the $182M. End of story.
….to those who point to the numbers at the Summit last week, keep in mind that the chances of both SDSU teams being in the championship game ever again are very slim.
There are those who pointed to the Summit League tourney to justify a McArena???? Give me a break. 14 games…most involving the Jacks….and still only 40,000 in attendance? The good mayor would do just as well by pointing out the 1900 at last nights Stampede game or the 2200 at the Skyforce game the night before.
Poly, even worse – last year’s Summit Tourney, where SDSU was bounced in the first round, averaged just over 2000 per game. Of course, they still used it to justify a new McArena because the scorer’s table buzzer malfunctioned. Yep, spend $200 million instead of the $200 for a new buzzer!
All towns/cities that have the capabilities to host school events should have that opportunity…we don’t need to become Sioux Falls the State. Those other communities deserve to have the revenue just as much if not more!
Even from a purely pragmatic perspective, it’s probably in the City’s best interests to share the wealth, so to speak. Sioux Falls has a huge political problem, in that many residents in the state see SF as something “other” than the rest of the state, i.e. SF vs. the rural areas.
In most other states (e.g. MN) a large public arena in the largest town in the state would have had financial support from the State Legislature. Ditto on other large capital projects, like transit improvements, downtown revitalizations, etc. Here in SF, we’re basically told to pay our own way, and I believe that’s a direct result of the sometimes haughty attitude we display to the rest of the state.
(As an aside, we should all be extremely thankful that the state has authorized us to collect a full 2% city sales tax. Minnesota caps municipal sales taxes at 0.5%, so most cities rely entirely on property taxes. 2% is a HUGE local funding source.)
However, I will say that the All-State Band and Orchestra concerts should be at the Washington Pavillion EVERY SINGLE YEAR. There are no other comparable facilities in the state. I’ll never forget the 3 miserable All-States I spent performing in venues like the Yankton High School Gym.
Devils advocate?
If you are from Sioux Falls, do you want to go to Watertown, Mitchell, Aberdeen for a 3 day tourney? Probably not. But every given weekend of the year the mall is full of 5 or 3 or 8 or 36 license plates.
Last year Watertown had a girls national slowpitch tourney. Not sure if they had a single Sioux Falls team go. But I am willing to bet if that tournament would have been held in SF, almost every SD team entered in Watertown would have gone to SF to play, plus probably others from Huron, Mitchell, etc. who did not come to Watertown.
Watertown, Mitchell, and even Aberdeen do not have the motels or dining to host most major events. Sure the motels are full for those weekends, but usually the arenas are not. Why? Because people don’t go because they can not get a room.
Brookings can get away with as they are close enough to SF, Watertown, and probably even Huron that people will drive back and forth.
Most of the tournament crowds when coming to one of the other cities are going to spend their dollars for alcohol, motels and food. With the DUI laws and crack down, most of the alcohol consumed is purchased at locally owned package stores to drink in their rooms.
If at a lounge, it will be at the motel lounge. Most of the dining will be done at fast food, pizza, or national chains.
Most of these food places, plus almost all of the motels are owned by out of state or Sioux Fall business owners any way so not much of the profit stays here. Sure, the sales tax dollars does, but not the 7 time circulation of money spent.
As far as shopping, about the only shopping done at one of these other towns is if someone forgot to pack underwear, swimming suits, or toothpaste.
The biggest problem is unlike the old days of the “Big B”, other then SDHSAA has to many classes and a watered down product, is that the atmosphere of the “State Tournament” is gone because it is an easy ticket to get and there are no crowds. People like crowds, which draws bigger crowds.
I think basketball should be one venue and that venue in SF. Kids deserve to play their championship in front of the biggest crowds possible. The state has a lot of other events they can share around the state, that towns can handle. Put VB in an arena of 5,000 and try and fill it. It is a great sport, but does not have the following to fill the new event center. But state basketball might be able to fill the place up, cause some excitement for high school state basketball again.
As a parent who has been ripped off in Aberdeen, Pierre, Rapid City, and other “host” cities in SD by inflated motel prices due to tournament traffic, and waited an hour for a table in their local franchise restaurant, and had to take the kids to HyVee and use the hotel lobby microwave at 10 PM because the fast food places shut down, please…..move the tourneys to Sioux Falls.
An important point to note in this discussion ois that the proposal did not come from Sioux Falls. It came from a resident of Pierre – the head of the SDHSAA (South Dakota Hoigh School Activities Association). That organization’s mssion is to MAXIMIZE funding for students who wish to particpate in extra-curricular activities – ALL extracurricular activities; art, drama, music and athletics. It just happens that the single largest SOURCE of evenues for the SDHSAA are the state chanpionshop athletic tournaments. It also just happens that when those tournaments are held in Sioux Falls – the SDHSAA make MORE MONEY – which is the ONLY source it has for supporting all of the other “non revenue” activities – those that cost more to operate than they bring in. The entire intent of this proposal is to INCREASE FUNDING for HS activities. PERIOD. There is no other reason. Bottom line – If you are against it – you are against increasing education funding. So – there you go citizen legislators.
rufus:
Great points, I guess I missed that part of the reasoning. This must have been Mayor Mike’s rationale all along: spend $182M to generate a few $100K more per year for HS activities! Bravo!
“It came from a resident of Pierre – the head of the SDHSAA (South Dakota Hoigh School Activities Association).”
Actually he is being pressured by many ‘top dogs’ in SF. Sanford Health has given millions of dollars to the association over the years.
I agree with rufusx, the discussion here is since is going to be built, not an argument if it should have been built.
I read the other day that there are some legislators that are thinking about abolishing the SDHSAA and give athletics to the board of education.
If you pay any attention to what is coming out of that office, they seem to have their hands full trying to figure out how to kill the teachers union and seeing if they can get spending on education below Guam so we can be 51st, so they do not need to worry about who is BB state champs.
I have to say I used to appreciate your blog, but it is getting a little ridiculous. I am all for skepticism; however, you’re blog has become nothing more than a constant vomit of an inordinate amount of cynicism. Still, I applaud your commitment to covering the happenings in City Hall. In that regard, no one does as a good of a job as you. Nonetheless, please stop your desperate attempts at personifying Hunter S. Thompson before no one other than certain paranoid cynics take you seriously.
Huh?
Check the records, Sanford has donated millions to the association. Not sure I was being cynical, just stating the truth, and even if I was, I have been cynical from day one.
Why should SF get all the revenue from State Tournaments. Let some of the other cities have some. Remember, these are state tournaments, and SF is not the only city that participates. Having all of them there sounds a little “hoggish” to me.
Well, we do have a ton of greedy bastards in the city, that’s for sure.
I am not quite sure if I am for or against this move, however, I would like to see the massive portion of sales tax revenue that comes out of SF and back to state funding. People can complain all they want about SF, but face it, as long as SF keeps growing and thriving – the rest of the state and all of these communities benefit on a daily basis.
And as a side note – I completely agree with the person who stated the All-State Chorus and Band should take place at the Wash Pav EVERY year. It is by far the most beautiful and is more than able to accomodate visitors with hotels and restaurants. These perfromers want to play/sing in the Great Hall – not a HS gym or arena. I attended one way back when in Aberdeen and we ended up staying in THEE biggest rat hole I have ever been in.
If Lewis was going for the Hunter S. Thompson approach, ever post would begin with 5000 or so words detailing every pill and drink he consumed and then the perilous full-speed drive to confront whatever asshole he is condemning. I don’t see that.
De said ‘Hi’ to me today, then handed me a wood log.
Funniest thing I’ve read in quite some time.
Alice – fully agree, some activities just have to be held in SF, other cities cannot accomodate them. But I think it is a little ridiculous to believe that other cities cannot hold tournaments. I know that the state pool and dart tournament takes turns every year between SF and RC. That may be an option. Another option is requiring the city that is hosting the tournament to prove they have enough hotel rooms and eating establishments.
The B schools would never have enough people in attendance to be worth having the tournament in SF. I even have doubts that the A schools would do that. The B tournament is perfectly fine in towns like Aberdeen, Watertown, etc. One thing that has to be taken into consideration is the economy, there are people that can’t afford to attend these games even if they have kids participating. I watched almost all of the AA tournament and there were several empty seats in the Rushmore Civic Center.
Let me get this right. We lost the SkyForce to the the new Sanford Health Pentagon … and then silence from our city fathers, and now they proudly want to replace it with two additional weekend tournaments per year?
On an other note, The SDHSAA should be more concerned about location and convenience to its students and their parents, rather then filling an Events Center, which most South Dakotans did not have the opportunity to vote for or against, nor did they ask for it.
Perhaps this can all be explained by understanding that
South Dakota has evolved into a tricameral system …
a State House of Representatives, a State Senate, and
a Sanford Board of Directors. But the latter is more like
the House of Lords and has the financial resources and
tenacity to act unilaterally without any any checks and
balances.
Gonzo Journalehrisman?
I don’t know that I necessarily care if some tournaments are held other places, however I concur with l3wis that if you do not have enough hotel and eating establishments – you shouldn’t be able to hold tournaments – end of discussion. If you are in Aberdeen and run out of rooms – where is the next best spot? At least in Brookings – you have options in SF and Watertown. When SF holds gigantic soccer tournaments – I guarantee their geographic for ammenities expands into Brandon, Brookings etc. My only observation with the above is that we have felt the need to have events such as the AA girl’s b-ball tournament in places such as Yankton. I’m sorry – but Yankton is not equipped for this tournament – especially when the teams themselves take at least one hotel. Common sense needs to ride some of these decisions and it seems that has escaped us.
And just one full weekend a year – or once every 4 years – is not a sound bit of business reasoning to build a new motel in Aberdeen – or Watertown, or Mitchell, or Yankton etc. etc. etc. Seriously.
Agreed…and I feel the same way that once a year or so when everybody rings their hands because some softball and/or soccer team can’t find rooms here in SF.
All state orchestra could be at the Pavillion, but there are a few hundred kids in the all state chorus. I’m sure they’d like to use the Pavillion but there isn’t room.
Frankly most of us would be just as happy if Sioux Falls were annexed by Iowa or Minnesota as we have that much in common with residents of all 3.
The SDHAA has one point summarized as gouging and services. Good contracts will fix both as most SD towns are mentally ill-equipped to host events since they want to roll-up the streets at 10.
Bottom line – follow the money. As DWU economics professor testified there is no reason on earth for SD taxpayers to further subsidize the urban lifestyle and costs of Sioux Falls, or for that matter Rapid City. These towns will take care of their own and need no help from state taxpayer subsidies or regulatory schemes to transfer tax dollars or ancillary event fees.
“These towns will take care of their own and need no help from state taxpayer subsidies or regulatory schemes to transfer tax dollars or ancillary event fees.”
Does that mean we don’t have to fund state government anymore by almost 33%? Think it is funny how everyone is a hater when it comes to SF, yet if it were not for us, there would be no state government.
Precisely – would love to see one of those tax dollar donor/reciever maps of SD by county. Who’s dependent on whom?
Not to mention all the money we suck out of Iowa and Minnesota, and even Nebraska.