http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Enucpg-ZEPI
About a month ago I was driving past the Events Center, and wondered why the panels on the building were rippling, I asked a couple (construction) people in the know. One person told me, “Looks like they just bolted the panels to steel studs.” Another said, “Can’t wait for a strong wind to come up, those panels will be everywhere, besides on the building.” I even mentioned it to some city officials.
Hey, I am no expert, but as an artist, I do notice the finer details. It looks like shit. It also looks like shoddy work, but you know, as Poly would say, “This is how you build a $100 million dollar events center.”
I guess I am not the only one to notice, apparently there have been complaints about the panels, which prompted councilor Tex Golfing to question ‘Jason’ from Mortenson construction about the ‘rippling’ at the city informational today during the EC update. Jason explained there will be a ‘design review’. Then Rex asked, ‘Is this supposed to happen?’ After a long pause, Jason says, ‘I am not going to answer that question.’
As a person who worked as a sider (cedar) and also as a person who worked in farming around galvanized steel and grain bins, this is obviously being done on the cheap. If you want a building to last for 50+ years, this is not how you construct the outer shell, not just for aesthetics but for durability. Construction companies often take short cuts due to budgets (profits). This is unfortunate, especially since taxpayers will be footing the bill and interest payments on this aluminum shack for years to come.
See, folks, if we would have had full control of the contractors on this place, we would know. But instead we hired the super secretive construction management company.
If anything, I sure hope the lamb tips at the VIP lounge taste good, let’s hope they don’t skimp on that to. Ever taste dog?
Isn’t there a warranty?
3:02 in the youtube video: “Try to be humble, try to give back” Oh by being humble you mean brag up giving the $700,000 and ask to have your name on the publicly owned building.
What flavor is the humble pie, we know how to describe it: greed, deceit, grandstanding.
Looks like this is a self promotion award. The family decides on a goal to get this award and they probably gave a generous donation from the family trust fund to ensure winning it in 2011. Nice going Mikey.
TENNIS FAMILY OF THE YEAR*
This award is made annually to the family who in recent years has done the most to promote amateur tennis – primarily
on a volunteer basis. Ideally all members of the family should participate in some way, either as a player or by offering
their services in promoting tennis.
Each family member must be current USTA members.
Criteria:
1) The family must be active in volunteering in some or all of the following:
a) Serving as a volunteer in fostering tennis at any level of the USTA such as national, section, district
and/or local board or committee tournament and adult and/or junior programs.
b) Developing and/or sustaining junior and adult programs
c) Holding office(s) at the various levels of the USTA
d) Volunteer coaching
e) Competing in tennis, such as high school or college varsity (include age category rankings) League or
other organized play, social/recreational play.
f) Enriching the game of tennis in other related activities such as non-tennis related activity, honors
and/or achievements.
Please include the years of service for each activity for each family member. The section winner will be submitted for
consideration of the USTA Tennis Family of the Year national award that is presented at the USTA Annual Meeting.
* Eligible for national award recognition.
It looks like the siding you would put on a cheap trailer house, not what you would expect from a $183m events center.
Since when does a construction management company not have to answer to a City Councilor who appropriated the money for this project!!?
Ruf, LOL! I didn’t think a warranty kicked in until a project is completed.
SF Res, ‘They are looking into it.’ Of course we all know who was involved in helping to design the facility, bouncing pavilion mezzanine himself, this oughta turn out OK, right?
In the past decade event centers have been popping up all over the country. SF is not unique in this department. Just late in showing up to the party. Will the place have sellouts? First year. You bet. But in the long run? Don’t think so. Just google “event centers losing money”. You’ll run into many articles, just like this one.
http://m.siouxcityjournal.com/news/local/budget-crunch-could-shake-up-sioux-city-s-events-department/article_77ff6922-6818-5d0d-b428-b85125f46be7.html
“It was also a project goal to make this building beautiful,” Siemonsma said. Lipstick on a pig is what she means.
Staying on budget, the city was able to upgrade some features: a better sound system, fabric seats, diamond polished floors instead of flat concrete and wood cloud ceiling panels instead of an unfinished ceiling. A better sound system to hide the creaky as the building settles. Highly polished floors so it is easier to clean up the mess when the beer can siding blows off the building. Funky ceiling panels to hide the ceiling.
Refresh my memory l3wis,
Who is the bouncing Pavilion mezzanine himself?
The EC renderings on siouxfalls.org show pre-cast materials for the entire exterior.
I wonder if the exterior of the building is one of those areas they cut back on in order to cover all those “add-ons”!
Contracts for the EC were awarded a month before citizens voted approval and a site was selected. There was no competitive bid process. The original estimate was 100 million. It ended up costing 183 million. The best comparison is the Lincoln NE EC. It was 300 million with competitive bids and design review/inspection. I suspect, without bid process and inspections, the profit here was more than for Lincoln. Essentially we have perhaps a 70 million structure while they have a 240 million one.
Doesn’t surprise me it’s falling apart. It will be expensive if not impossible to get insurance. I’ll not be surprised when there’s roof or support failure. The fix will cost more than if it were built structurally sound.
I’ll not go inside there ever.
The answer lies in looking at other projects that have this same exterior metal specified (on a radius wall) and look to see if they look the same after install. It might be that’s what it’s supposed to look like or it might be the low bid contractor botched it since he was so cheap. If it’s the latter, then there’s contract documents with teeth in place to address their workmanship failure and if they don’t fix it the City can take actions to rectify it at the contractor’s expense.
I can tell you one thing, they are being very particular on what passes for acceptable on the interior. It will look and feel upscale and the finishes will show that. When the City did the Convention Center back in the ’90s they took the low tile bid and the hack who installed it was terrible.
Sy, those famous bathrooms MMM referred to in his 2010 mayoral campaign are probably wonderful.
The exterior of the building is not.
Yesterday, after extensive questioning from the Council about the exterior of the building, the Mayor leaned over and gave his Special Projects Manager, Kendra Siemonsma, directions on what to say to the Council.
She confirmed there is a problem with the exterior siding.
If they knew there was a problem, why did they allow the entire exterior to be skinned?
Nowhere in the AL’s (J.L. Atyeo) fluff piece in today’s paper does she even mention there is potentially a major problem with the exterior!!
@ SF It’s still constructed with precast panels, the metal is aesthetics and they didn’t cut back on the design. Construction went faster and they didn’t use contingency funds that were set aside, as it went smoother too. The GC sent back the unused contingency funds and the City spent it on adding back in some upgrades they took out earlier in the process.
@ Dan No, actually they did bid competitively and unlike Lincoln, they didn’t run into a bunch of unseen issues early on in the process. Pinnacle is nice, but they had to cut way back on finishes in order to meet budget. They had one point where the place sat dormant and unfinished for months while they figured it out. We put at least 7 different budget bids in front of them over 12 months before we were finally awarded our contract.
I suspect comment #6 will come true. Basketball has already moved to Sanford Center. Hockey & indoor football have a declining audience the convention center can handle. Tennis will have its own facility. Monster trucks, motocross, roller derby, etc. have diminishing audiences that fill only 1/3 seats. Tractor pulls and farm machinery shows would occupy the floor but not the seats. The EC can’t be supported from concerts alone. Just another Huether ego trip. Build it and they didn’t come.
Meanwhile, how much of the content of the posts on this topic actually address the issue of potential materials problems and what to do about them? 5%?
Mostly, what is posted here – REGARDLESS of the actual topic is one-track minded government bashing. Yeah – some real “problem solvers” here alright. Can’t even address the problem.
Rufsux, first off don’t care. I didn’t vote for the place, and probably the only time I will attend it will be for a FREE event. Most likely I will probably see some benefit when big concerts and conventions are in town (waiting tables). I don’t care if they build the place out of Styrofoam cups and tooth picks. While I wasn’t opposed to a Construction risk manager handling the project, I was hoping they would be a little more open with their suppliers and contractors. Councilor Jamison and Staggers have asked for this information several times from Cotter, Smith and Turbak, and the answer is always the same ‘We will get back to you.’ They have been handing them this line for over a year now. The only reason the EC and indoor pool are being built is to make a lot of contractors a lot of money, while the rest of us foot the bill. I hope they figure out the paneling problem, but my guess is that it will be handled like the bouncing mezzanine at the Pavilion, the taxpayers will be picking up the bill.
Some interesting responses from Jason Miranowski, rep for Mortenson:
KDLT.com South Dakota News – Paneling On Events Center To Be Reviewed
Great First Impression for a 183 million dollar facility!
I can just see the bonding company running for the hills on this one in the event the prime folds. Maybe we will find out that mmm opened mouth inserted foot and created a constructive change order that won’t be covered by bond Company or warranty but by the tax payer. Get your first premier credit card out mmm we could have Morton building or butler building come and fix the eye sore. Lol.
see KELO.com
City Leaders Looking At Events Center Paneling
Cotter said the City has expressed concerns to the construction company and the architects. At this point, they are still figuring out what they will need to do to fix the paneling on the multi-million dollar building.
Sink Combs Dethlefs (Don Dethlefs)
Koch Hazard (Jeff Hazard)
Mortenson Construction – Subcontractor Scope of Work for the Denny Sanford PREMIER Center Project:
Scope of Work
Subcontractor
Concrete – Structural Precast
Gage Brothers
Concrete – Architectural Precast
Gage Brothers
HVAC/Louvers/Controls
Tessiers Inc
Plumbing/Piping
Tessiers Inc
Fire Protection
Midwestern Mechanical
Electrical-No Low Voltage
Muth Electric
Excavation & Site Prep
— McCart Field
— Temp Utility Work
— Site Clearing
Soukup Construction
Deep Foundations
Veit Specialty Contracting
Concrete-CIP Foundations (FRP)
Peska Construction
Rock Removal
Sweetman Construction
Structural Steel
— Structural Metal Framing
— Metal Decking
— Long Span Roof System
Egger Steel Company, Paxton Vierling
Steel, Schuff Steel, LPR Construction
Concrete -Flatwork (FRP)
— SOMD
— SOG
— Stairs
Peska Construction
Elevators/Escalators
Kone Inc
Loading Dock Equipment
Overhead Doors of Sioux Falls
Ice Rink
CIMCO Refrigeration Inc
Food Service / Residential Equipment
Institution Services, Inc
Multiple Seating
Hussey Seating Company
Masonry
— Interior Masonry
— Exterior Masonry
— Stone
Jensen Masonry Inc
Misc. Metals
— Handrail/railings
— Stairs/ladders
— Grating/Floor Plates
— Ornamental Metal
— Misc. Metals
Gil Haugan / Egger Steel Company
Exterior Glazing Systems
— Exterior Entrances & Storefronts
— Exterior Glazing & Curtainwall
— Interior Entrances & Storefronts
— Interior Windows
— Glass, Mirrors, & Glazing
Heartland Glass Company
Mtl Stud/Insulation/Gyp/Acoustical Walls
— Exterior Building Insulation
— Exterior Metal Support Assemblies
— Rough Carpentry
— Interior Metal Support Assemblies
— Gypsum Boar
Midwest Partitions, Inc
Any concern we have as the owner, we are here to protect the taxpayer dollars,” Cotter said.
The City Council needs to appear to be more involved in oversight of this issue/project than they were at Tuesday’s Informational meeting. And, they certainly need to be more agressive with Mortenson’s arrogant, dismissive rep, Mr. Jason Miranowski!!
Based on this exterior “upgrade”, a contest to rename the Denny:
The Grain Bin
Cotter stressed that the issue does not hurt the structure of the building. This is merely a cosmetic issue.
How can aluminum strips be structural? Of course its not going to hurt how the building stands upright. What Mr. Cotter is not saying is how cheaply the structure is built behind the panels. Flimsy, light gauge steel studs covered with yellow polystyrene foam then coated with straight strips of aluminum on a curving wall.
Sounds structural to me, how about you?
Anyone who has attached straight strips of formed metal will know it cannot be attached to a curving surface without pre-curving or forming the panels to the shape needed. The screws and clips are being asked to carry the attaching load of changing weather and building age stress.
Look at the east end metal of the building and look at the west end strip issues separately. I watched these go on and go on quickly. These appeared to be attached through a grid and snap system. The attaching hardware used were probably sheetmetal screws to the cheap / lightweight metal studs. These galvanized metal studs flex a great deal and are not structural. Now we have the stress of formed metal panels being forced to curve with the building. The panels were made to go on a straight and square wall. These panels are going to continue to put stress on the self tapping attachment screws used, as the South Dakota weather extremes allow.
The architect is trying to be Frank Lloyd Wright, Pei or Geary without knowing anything about metal stresses. Kind of reminds me of the Pavilion and other projects the city has contracted and we continue to pay forever.
They do not care if the place falls down in AFTER they are out of office as long as it looks good right NOW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZflQbJ_EbY
So, EC Inspector, would this DESIGN failure be the responsibility of Koch Hazard or Sink Combs Dethlefs or both?
I, also, watched everyday as the exterior was finished. Why do you think they did not stop the process when they saw there was a problem?
In listening to the EC update to the Council (see Informational Meeting, Tuesday, May 27, @siouxfalls.org), perhaps they should have focused less on all those “extras and enhancements” to the interior of the facility and instead focused on getting the exterior right!
Also, l3wis, hope you’re not counting on hanging-out in the VIP lounge (open ONLY to those who have private suites, loge boxes and club seats).
Any doubts about this, take a look at the entrance to the private club vs. the entrance to the public club. (page 6, EC Update, City Council Informational Meeting, May 27).
Interesting, given that this ENTIRE facility is funded by ALL taxpayers.
L3wis:
“but my guess is that it will be handled like the bouncing mezzanine at the Pavilion, the taxpayers will be picking up the bill.”
First of all you got your facts wrong, the Architect Koch Hazard stepped up and paid for the repair at the Pavillion and also adding the skinny columns to reduce the span on the mezzanine to eliminate the bounce.
Second, Mortenson is the General Contractor, hired as Construction Manager at Risk, not a sub. Which means they are bonded for these types of issues when they arise and also any subcontractor with any level of scope (say more than $50K) on this project had to provide their own bid bond which not only ensures they can do what they propose, but also they assume the responsibility for shitty workmanship that leads to a re-do. If that company can’t or won’t perform, Mortenson will find the replacement and litigate the issue until resolution. Maybe that will take the guy under & if so, that’s a good thing for the industry as whole.
Mortenson builds over $6 BILLION worth of projects a year, they aren’t going under on a $120 million building and they aren’t going to run away and say “you’re screwed” after they get the final payment. They are an extremely reputable contractor, which is partly why they were hired over equally reputable local contractors.
Let the process play out for fux sake.
@ EC You don’t know WTF you’re talking about. None of those Architect’s styles are represented in the EC design. Try more like the minimalist, curvilinear designs of Eero Saarinen or Rem Koolhaas
@ cr/taxpayer
If the product specified wasn’t installed properly, then it’s not a design flaw.
& L3wis isn’t a VIP lounge type so I doubt he gives a shit. You also assume incorrectly as a taxpayer we are all equally entitled to everything. Some folks pay a lot more taxes then others and some folks get to keep some of the profits from years of running companies, working hard and assuming the risks of doing so. Why shouldn’t they get to spend their money on a loge box or a club seat and get to go to their own club where there will be less of a wait then standing in line with everyone else who didn’t? At the rate these premium seats sold there’s undeniably a market for them, are you trying to argue the City shouldn’t have exploited that in favor of making the entire building the same for everyone? Had they done so, they wouldn’t have raised as much $$ ($37 million) to fund the place over time and you’d be bitching about that too.
Ruf is right, this is a nitpicking fest by a bunch of wannabe church ladies.
Ironic that Sy evokes the name of Eero Saarinen in a thread, the very premise of which is that the design, material and/or workmanship of this project is NOT on par with that of the Gateway Arch.
Lacking also are the sharp lines and interesting angles which would draw comparison to a Rem Koolhaus-inspired design, don’t you think?
Based on this exterior “upgradeâ€, a contest to rename the Denny:
The Grain Bin
I think the Grain Bin will win and is fitting, how about the Silver Bullet, better yet the Silver Streak, heading for a train wreck
Sy says:
You also assume incorrectly as a taxpayer we are all equally entitled to everything. Some folks pay a lot more taxes then others and some folks get to keep some of the profits from years of running companies, working hard and assuming the risks of doing so. Why shouldn’t they get to spend their money on a loge box or a club seat and get to go to their own club where there will be less of a wait then standing in line with everyone else who didn’t?
Sy, thank you for proving my point.
Elitist Entitlement
Sy your comment: @ EC You don’t know WTF you’re talking about. None of those Architect’s styles are represented in the EC design. Try more like the minimalist, curvilinear designs of Eero Saarinen or Rem Koolhaas proves the point. They know how to make materials curve. This design or lack thereof, shows they were not ready for the problems we are now seeing. The problems will only get worse.
Looks like an expanded farm machine shed to me. But then, MOST American architecture looks like really quickly thrown-together live for-the-moment temporary crap to me. It’s actually somewhat shocking when I’ve been out of the country for a couple weeks or more to return and be struck by the incredible cheap shabbiness of the place – ESPECIALLY around here in fly-over country. Happens every time.
This country’s architecture has all the perceivable quality and permanence of a movie set.
ruf, you are right. I have seen grain bins built with a look of more permanence.
Decided to take a drive by the events Center with a friend who has experience in the construction business to see what all the fuss is about. The shoddy look of that rippled aluminum siding is bad enough, but I agree with EC inspector it will never hold up in high winds/winter weather.
Doesn’t it make you wonder about decisions MM and his staff are making about building projects in town?He is intent on getting his bucket list done and done quickly before he leaves office and leaving the debt and repair to all of us it appears.
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