Ironic Johnny our teflon senator
As many in the National media have been covering the ‘C’ Street Mafia, including Rachel Maddow’s extensive coverage over the past couple of weeks, it seems the SD Media is asleep at the wheel. It is widely known that John Thune is either a member or a past member of the group, but no one in this state’s media seem to be concerned about it. Why? Good question. A couple of weeks ago I emailed KELO, KSFY and the Gargoyle Leader about the story and did speak with a Gargoyle journalist about it. Still no story. I guess the lingering question is pretty simple;
Senator Thune, do you still belong to the group, and if so, is it’s Christian Theocratic mission anti-democratic?
I don’t know what bothers me more, that Thune belongs to this group, or that the SD MSM is ignoring his association. Please, someone, anyone, ask the questions.
From a 2005 interview with ironic johnny.
Do you find fellowship with other legislators?
I do. There are several different Bible study groups on Capitol Hill. I’ve not had an opportunity yet in the Senate to really get immersed. But when I was a member of the House, there were a couple of organizations, one called Christian Embassy that is affiliated with Campus Crusade for Christ whose mission it is to reach out and reach and disciple people in the legislative branch, the executive branch, and in the military at the Pentagon. And also the C Street ministry, which initially came from Doug Coe. Coe was influential at Chuck Colson’s conversion too. But those are a couple of ministries that are active out there. And there are other members of Congress who come to those events. There are a number who are very serious about their faith. I do have a chance to interact with them.
l3wis, it’s the tiny state captured media syndrome that we recently saw when Palin was unmasked. When a local tool or fool or foolish tool gets a big head mistakenly thinking that, “by golly miss molly my nonsensical ideology made it big in Hootersville, maybe it will fly nationally” – but then the rest of the nation takes a few moments to do what the local media should have done all along – expose the hypocrisy, the inconsistency, the shady deals, the greased palms, to wit – they follow the money.
Under real scrutiny Thune will blow apart like a straw scare-crow in a South Dakota gale.
On the other hand there are those from small states who are what they appear, decent and ethically solid, like Huckabee – it’s just that we don’t want his kool-aid.
Huck frightened me a bit when he defined his “compassionate conservatism”. He’s socially conservative and fiscally liberal – the exact opposite of what this country needs.
John, I agree, but you would think with so many national media sources reporting the story, someone locally would just ask him the simple question, “Do you still belong to the group.” I am really starting to believe that local media is not only lazy and stupid, but incredibly irresponsible and inept.
L3wis,
Why would they waste their time on this story?
I mean, just because John hangs out there, worships there, seeks counsel there, recieves guidance there, maybe has one of these guys marry him or baptize his kids there, dedicates a book to them, get campaign support from them, none of that stuff says anything about his level of involvement with them or his worldview. It may be the exact opposite, God knows there’s no way to tell such a thing about an organization, even if you’ve been going there for 20 years or more.
If one of them goes off the deep end on YouTube, all John has to do is say that’s not the person he remembers or is buddies with. It will be a teachable moment for all of us to marvel in.
This has nothing to do with Obama or his former church.
Leave it to cartoonists — guess what Doonesbury is covering this week?
http://www.doonesbury.com/strip/dailydose/
And how exactly would exposing Thune as a Christian fanatic hurt him here? Isn’t that his base?
Leave it to Sy to use the old “bu bu bu but Obama…” defense.
Raise your hand if you saw that one coming.
I don’t care what religion JT is a part of, I just think he is undermining what our forefathers stood for, Freedom, Liberty, Freedom of Speech and freedom of religion. I don’t care what peoples faith is, it is not the governments job to convert people to x-tiananity.
GoD:
“This has nothing to do with Obama or his former church.”
We were told his former church had nothing to do with candidate Obama and that is was entirely plausible a person could attend for 20 years, get married by the pastor, have children baptized by the pastor, dedicate a book to one of the pastors writings, call him a mentor, all the while while having no idea that the pastor was filled with anti-American, racist venom.
You bought that line, Dude…in fact you were more offended by what a few of Palin’s supporters screamed at her rallies than what Obama’s pastor was screaming in his services.
Costner:
“Leave it to Sy to use the old “bu bu bu but Obama…†defense.
Raise your hand if you saw that one coming.”
Like I said, many old standards were casually tossed aside in the last election.
When you try to bring them back just to apply them to a Republican it reeks of hypocrisy.
eeewww eeeew that smell.
I smell it.. it’s Sy’s bullshit factory in full swing.
L3wis:
“I don’t care what peoples faith is, it is not the governments job to convert people to x-tiananity.”
I agree, but I also think we should ackowlege that our Founding Fathers were all deeply religious men. They kept our founding documents intentionally non-denominational, but at the same time were ALL in agreement that our enumerated rights were endowed by God almighty Himself.
Have a nice nosefull of that, AG.
Keith Olbermann is doing a commentary as I type and he just took Thune apart. It is wonderful.
For all of you reading this, Olbermann replays at 9 PM central, can’t wait to see it
Sy, they did believe in God, a creator, as I do, but they also understood the dogma of religion. Hamilton, Jefferson, Franklin and Washington were deists, (as far as I am concerned, besides Adams, were our greatest founders). They knew that theocracy would complicate a democracy, not faith. There is a difference. You can pray and love God without being a Christian, someone should tell Thune.
The founding fathers knew that a great nation could never be founded on fiction instead of fact. Don’t kid yourself, religion – ALL religion – is fiction. That’s why they said freedom of religion not freedom of christianity or budism or judeism or muslim(ism?)or… I say; Believe in God, Trust in Science. Hey that would make a good bumpersticker.
I also believe our founders, with all their flaws, were good people, who wanted to help mankind not ministers and priests recruit people to religion. Peace and love of your fellow man is built on understanding not on bullshit. Freedom of speech and liberty educates us about your fellow man. It makes us wiser. Following a book written 2,000 years ago doesn’t tell us shit.
There is some confusion in the comments here over wondering what the harm is about fellowship, after all, isn’t Christianity about being nice, caring for the sick and meek?
Well, no, not when you can look at the Bible in a whole different light and see that morals and ethics are for the lowly ones. Those in POWER are allowed to break the rules, because the ends justify the means. Think about Hitler and Bin Laden as examples of extremism and above the moral rules and you’ve got the attitude of those in POWER in the C Street houses.
Coe did some unique and extremist Biblical interpretation that is not mainstream down home Christianity. It’s more about power, influence and not really helping the poor, but more about the powerful helping themselves and a way they can feel good about it is deluding themselves that God wants it that way.
Way to go anon, you’ve ruined the thread by invoking Godwin’s Law.
idiot.
You bought that line, Dude…in fact you were more offended by what a few of Palin’s supporters screamed at her rallies than what Obama’s pastor was screaming in his services.
I didn’t buy any lines. I just didn’t care.
Yes, I was much more offended by how completely unhinged the right became during the election. A party who runs with that BS doesn’t deserve to be in power.
I;m hoping they’ll learn their lesson and come roaring back in 2010 without the wingnuts, but so far, I’m not hopeful. A good percentage of republicans still question Obama’s citizenship.
I agree, but I also think we should ackowlege that our Founding Fathers were all deeply religious men.
Some were (John Adams, Patrick Henry), some weren’t (Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin).
Perhaps a closer investigation is in order.
If “our founding fathers were all deeply religious men…” then explain the Jefferson Bible, please.
Sure Jefferson & Franklin were deists, but what they wrote in our founding documents is as clear then as it is today. Our rights came from our Creator. If TJ or BF were queasy about that they would’ve walked away from the table, it’s not like they were wallflowers just there for a painting op.
Jefferson was a complex guy, to say the least. He did his version of the Bible, what 30 years later? Like many he had his issues with religion(s) and that’s how he chose to combat them. The man never renounced his faith.
GoD:
“Yes, I was much more offended by how completely unhinged the right became during the election. A party who runs with that BS doesn’t deserve to be in power.”
You mean fear-mongering? Maybe you haven’t noticed, but the current party in power in DC uses fear even more than the previous one. You’ll need to find a new planet if you want to get away from that. You specifically said you didn’t like Palin’s supporters claiming Obama was Muslim and/or Terrorist. Perhaps you could show me the fruit of your investigations that shows that was actual GOP party-line or platforn planks. I seem to recall McCain specifically saying that was a “no no”.
Sure Jefferson & Franklin were deists, but what they wrote in our founding documents is as clear then as it is today. Our rights came from our Creator. If TJ or BF were queasy about that they would’ve walked away from the table, it’s not like they were wallflowers just there for a painting op.
They put that in there because the way the Old World operated, fundamental rights like life, liberty, and property were granted by Kings, who could take them away on a whim. under that system (a holdover from midevel feudalism), the only entity higher than royalty was God.
Just because God (actually, a “creator”) is mentioned in the preamble to the declaration doesn’t mean we’re founded on any religious basis. It was simply a break from the past – a radical break at the time, by radical liberals.
Perhaps you could show me the fruit of your investigations that shows that was actual GOP party-line or platforn planks. I seem to recall McCain specifically saying that was a “no noâ€.
Yet it persisted long enough to make the news.
It was pretty clear from the primaries on that the far right wasn’t behind McCain. They showed up and voted for him for the same reason people showed up to vote for Kerry in ’04 – to vote against the other guy. When that’s all you have, you lose.
The party platform planks are meaningless – for both parties. Tell me the last time republicans attempted anything pro-life or in favor of traditional marriage that wasn’t just a half-assed bone-throw to the evangelical wing of the party. How about the last time they were actually fiscally conservative (not just fiscally conservative compared to democrats)?
Sorry, but they got exactly what they deserved in ’06 and ’08. If they actually grow a pair of balls and start going after deficits and runaway government, and ditch the idiotic social agenda, they can win me back. Until then, I’d just as soon see them as a minority party. They’ll evolve faster that way.
Sy: Sure Jefferson & Franklin were deists, but what they wrote in our founding documents is as clear then as it is today. Our rights came from our Creator. If TJ or BF were queasy about that they would’ve walked away from the table, it’s not like they were wallflowers just there for a painting op.
You do realise that Deists do in fact believe in a “creator” or higher power right? The difference is, they aren’t proclaiming it to be the Christian God or telling everyone that the Christian way of thinking is right and our nation is built upon Judeo-Christian values, because the reality is most of our founding fathers knew there was a line separating religion from government and the two needed to remain distinct from one another.
I can’t begin to count the number of times I have heard a Christian quote the “endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights” phrase from within The Declaration of Independence as if that suggests our founding fathers were all Christians or that our nation is built upon Christian values.
Nevermind that the term creator or even God is meant purposefully to be generic in nature, but add to that the fact the Declaraction is just that….a declaraction.
It did not set law, it did not form a framework for our nation, it was merely a Congressional declaration signifying our independence. Now if you were to look at our Constitution – you would soon realize the term “God” is nowhere to be found… and I hardly consider that to be an accident.